Default theme (Kubrick) should use the blog's default date format, not "F jS, Y"

[johnbillion]

In Options -> General it is possible to set the "default date format" and "default time format" to be displayed on your blog. However, Kubrick ignores these values and instead uses the_time('F jS, Y') for the post date. This means a user might change their date or time format and wonder why it is having no affect on their blog.

I propose a minor change to the Kubrick theme bundled with WP, so the_date() and the_time() are used without parameters, thus using the default date and time formats set in Options.

The following files in the default theme are affected:

• archive.php (line 37)
• attachment.php (line 29)
• comments.php (line 36)
• index.php (line 11)
• search.php (line 19)
• single.php (line 27)

The Classic theme isn't affected as it uses the_time() without parameters.

I apologise for not submitting diff files but I have no experience of them or CVS. I need to look into that.

[foolswisdom]

Replying to johnbillion:

I apologise for not submitting diff files but I have no experience of them or CVS.
I need to look into that.

Contact me any time, you will be surprised how easy it is.

[johnbillion]

Changes to the six affected files in Kubrick

[johnbillion]

Hurrah for learning Subversion in an hour!

[ryan]

The default date format is fairly useless because it is devoid of context. Most themes use a number of different formats depending on the context. The formats are usually marked with gettext so that they can be altered by translators to suit the locale.

Kubrick uses two different formats. If we think it is acceptable to distill these down to one, the patch is fine by me. In general, however, themes usually ignore default date format because they want to control the time and date formats as elements of the theme's style.

[johnbillion]

Ryan, you're absolutely right about context, however the two formats used in Kubrick hardly differ at all and the theme would not suffer if they were distilled into one.

The two formats are

• F jS, Y which produces something like February 11th 2007
• l, F jS, Y which produces something like Sunday, 11th February, 2007

the only difference being the displaying of the day of the week.

Third party themes should still be free to choose the format which the date is displayed in (which they of course are) when it is appropriate, for example in a situation where the default date might not be concise enough. I think this is beyond the discussion of this ticket though because it is to do with raising awareness of using the default date format where possible in third party themes.

The point which I am trying to address is that surely WordPress noobs (and indeed seasoned users) would expect the date format to change on his/her default template according to the changes they make to the default date format under Options.

[MichaelH]

This begets the question, "Why have the Default date and time formats in Options->General if they are not useful for themes (see ​http://trac.wordpress.org/ticket/3767#comment:3) or for the admin UI (see ​http://trac.wordpress.org/ticket/2601#comment:2)?"

[johnbillion]

Absolutely right MichaelH. The option could be removed entirely if no-one or nothing is going to use the default. The only issue this raises is what format to display when none is specified in the template/admin area function, which brings us back to square one where a default date format is needed. Catch 22.

[rob1n]

Where do we use the date settings, anywhere in the code? I don't think it's particularly useful, and we might as well just drop the default date format option.

[abelcheung]

Probably it is sane to remove this option from option page. However, OTOH it is vital to make some of the frequently used date/time format localisable, so people won't end up seeing strange date formats not belonging to their languages.

[sunburntkamel]

the reason most themes don't use the default formatting, is that when multiple posts are posted on the same day, the date only shows on the first one. so for index/archive pages, there needs to be

unset($previousday);

before

the_date()

is called without parameters.

[sunburntkamel]

patch including unset previous day

[Nazgul]

Added a patch which drops the default time and date format option from the General Options screen, because (as ryan mentions) they're useless without context.

I've left the backend in though, for backwards compatibility, for themes (and core code) which still use the option.

[rob1n]

They're used in the backend, IIRC.

[phr3ak]

sorry but i don't understand why don't remove the fix format of date in the default theme instead remove this feature?

[foolswisdom]

Replying to ryan:

The default date format is fairly useless because it is devoid of context. Most themes use a number of different formats depending on the context. The formats are usually marked with gettext so that they can be altered by translators to suit the locale.

Kubrick uses two different formats. If we think it is acceptable to distill these down to one, the patch is fine by me. In general, however, themes usually ignore default date format because they want to control the time and date formats as elements of the theme's style.

[rob1n]

Yes, I believe this has been discussed many times over. Wontfix.

[foolswisdom]

Based on the discussion does it not make sense to remove this option from the UI with Nazgul's patch?

[rob1n]

Replying to foolswisdom:

Based on the discussion does it not make sense to remove this option from the UI with Nazgul's patch?

I don't think so -- it's still used in the backend, I think. But neither are we going to change Kubrick's the_date() calls, so I guess, ...

[Nazgul]

Replying to rob1n:

I don't think so -- it's still used in the backend, I think. But neither are we going to change Kubrick's the_date() calls, so I guess, ...

It's indeed being used. But do you need to be able to change it from the admin?

[rob1n]

I suppose so. I know for an example, British people use DD/MM/YY format, whereas Americans use MM/DD/YY. Or people want something like 1-31-93 2:32:12 am instead of January 31, 1993 @ 2:32 AM.

[Nazgul]

Replying to rob1n:

I suppose so. I know for an example, British people use DD/MM/YY format, whereas Americans use MM/DD/YY. Or people want something like 1-31-93 2:32:12 am instead of January 31, 1993 @ 2:32 AM.

Ok, but that kinda contradicts with the reason why #2601 was closed. We should either use it everywhere or nowhere and not something in between.

[rob1n]

Well, the problem IMO is that there's not context with the field in the admin. What if you want a different form of date, for aesthetic reasons? Or just want "Tuesday, January 21"?

Maybe we just put a note in that it's just for some places in the admin? That way we would avoid confusion when they don't see any effects taking place.